Try identicate kanji form

Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Sun, 2015-08-23 21:15

Hi Everyone, I'm a new member, Jairo Araujo from Brazil.

I'm posting photos of my katana. After try understand the signature, please if someone can help me i will be glad.

Lets start with signature, first kanji of signature is 國 (KUNI) but i cant identify the second.

In the other side, have a mensage, I think it was not made in manufacturing process, i think it was made after, says "横山大膳X康子X" ("Yokoyama daizen xxx Yasushiko XXX")

Suemitsu Katana Kaji says frequently Japanese soldiers wrote their names or messages in military swords, i dont know if is correct or not.

横山 - can be "Katsutoshi, Yokoyama, Mizushi and Yohayama" i think is a surname,
大膳 - can be "Taizen, Daizen or Oozen" i think is a proper name,
Kanji X - i dont find this caracter,
康 - can meaning "Surname",
子 - can meaning "child",
康子 - can meaning a proper name "Yasushiko, Sadako, Yasuko, hideko, Michiko and Kouko" but all names ending in KO (子) are female names, like Tomiko, Akiko etc.
Kanji X - i dont find this caracter.

looking more closely there are bright yellow spots in the corners of Kanji message.

Antiques Swords (http://www.antique-swords.eu/) identify sword like a Japanese Gunto and not a chinese junk, but dont have time to search deeply about Kanji.

if anyone could help me it would be great, more photos on:
http://s24.photobucket.com/user/Jairo_Silva/media/WWII%20Katana/celular%...

Thanks!

nakago.jpg

mensagem.jpg


	#1Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Sat, 2015-10-31 01:50. someone can help? someone can help? Login or register to post comments


	#2Submitted by Sylvain on Sat, 2015-10-31 13:22. Maybe KUNINORI Hi ! Very hard to say from the picture. The sword is in a bad shape, so it's quite difficult to set on other details to confirm the mei. It looks like KUNINORI (國儀). I agree with you that on the ura side the inscription has been added later (much more). Sylvain Login or register to post comments


	#3Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Mon, 2015-11-02 00:58. Kunitora maybe? Sylvian What do you thing about 國虎 Kunitora? Login or register to post comments


	#4Submitted by saipan59 on Mon, 2015-11-02 02:44. The second kanji is The second kanji is difficult. There is clearly a "HI" radical in the upper-right corner. I looked through all of the KUNI-something in Hawley, and didn't find anything. Pete Login or register to post comments


	#5Submitted by Looper on Mon, 2015-11-02 10:12. Kunimichi? 國道 Login or register to post comments


	#6Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Mon, 2015-11-02 18:32. Kanji Draw I was able to draw the kanji, but still can not find it. see on link below http://s24.photobucket.com/user/Jairo_Silva/media/WWII%20Katana/ideogram... Login or register to post comments


	#7Submitted by saipan59 on Tue, 2015-11-03 04:33. upside down? An idea: Maybe we are looking at it upside-down. On a shortened nakago, sometimes the original mei is folded over to the other side, which makes it upside-down on the nakago. In your picture, I can almost see a seam (crack) to the right side of the 2 kanji. If I'm right, the mei is really "something-KUNI". Pete Login or register to post comments


	#8Submitted by John Johnson on Wed, 2015-11-04 15:40. Kunitora Dear All, This is my first post on the forum so hello and kind regards to everyone. I don't think that this is a mei that has been folded as it is normally easy to spot the extra thickness of metal where the metal has been folded back. There's an example here: http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/13867-bishu-osafune-sukesada-orikae... I'm inclined towards Sylvain's answer for the second kanji - "tora" 虎 (it looks a lot more like it if it is increased in size). This has some support in Hawleys where there are a number of smiths signing with this name throughout the shinto and shin shinto period. As to the writing on the other side of the blade, I'm utterly clueless. I hope that helps some, John Login or register to post comments


	#9Submitted by saipan59 on Thu, 2015-11-05 03:46. not Tora? Hi, I really don't see how it can be Tora. I'm looking at "TORA" in the "5 Kanji Styles" dictionary, and it's really not even close. This dictionary shows multiple hand-written styles for each kanji, including the 5 major styles such as KAISHOu, SOSHOu, etc. For TORA, it actually shows 31 examples. In this kanji, the bottom-most radical is the only part I see that would possibly match TORA. As for the "folded mei" theory: It may be a bad theory, but I see a hint of a rectangle surrounding the mei. For reference, if we assume that the tang is 1" wide, I see a faint horizontal line about 1/2" above KUNI, and also about 1/8" to the right of KUNI. Note the little blob to the right of the upper-right corner of KUNI - that blob is sitting on the vertical line that I see. One thing that might NOT support the theory is that the top+right stroke of KUNI looks correct as a single stroke - upside-down it doesn't look normal. Pete Login or register to post comments


	#10Submitted by saipan59 on Thu, 2015-11-05 04:43. inscription The other side is roughly this: YOKOYAMA DAIZEN KANEYASU-SHI MOTSU". The "KANE" is the one you called "kanji X". It is a stylish way to write it. The "SHI/KO" in this case (I think) is a title, similar to "Mister" in English. "MOTSU" means (in this case) "carried" or "owned". So, I think it is saying that this blade was carried by someone known as Kaneyasu. "Yokoyama Daizen" is a character in Kabuki...? Pete Login or register to post comments


	#11Submitted by saipan59 on Thu, 2015-11-05 05:34. name guesses Here's a couple of guesses for the name: KUNIKORE (KUN396). KUNIKAGE (KUN300). Pete Login or register to post comments


	#12Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Tue, 2015-11-10 01:51. Kabuki Thief I understand all, but one question remain in my head, why someone put a "Kabuki Thief" as a title in a katana? In mainly stories about Yokoyama Daizen, this guy is evil and a traitor. (http://www.apionet.or.jp/~yofmaeta/kabuki.htm) Login or register to post comments


	#13Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Tue, 2015-11-10 02:39. Kuniteru e Kunitora Please look at these: Kuniteru (http://www.sho-shin.com/kuniteru1a.jpg) Kunitora (http://www.sho-shin.com/kunitora1a.jpg) Kunikore ( I dont found any picture of signed katana) Kunikage (http://www.christies.com/lotfinder/arms-armor/a-mino-tradition-bizen-kat...) I found this, but i cant see signature image Many thanks for all people help. Login or register to post comments


	#14Submitted by saipan59 on Tue, 2015-11-10 02:44. Kuniteru The Kuniteru is definitely possible for the name, but not the same smith probably. As for the Kabuki: Perhaps it is the name of an actor who played Daizen...? Just a guess. Pete Login or register to post comments


	#15Submitted by jairoaraujo23 on Wed, 2015-11-11 10:49. Signature mistery solved Hi everyone The signature was solved by Markus Sesko http://markussesko.com/2015/10/06/kantei-4-yamashiro-9-awataguchi-粟田口-school-4/ Check this picture, no doubts https://markussesko.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/kunitsuna3.jpg Many thanks for all, I'm very happy Thanks Login or register to post comments

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Try identicate kanji form

someone can help?

Maybe KUNINORI

Kunitora maybe?

The second kanji is

Kunimichi?

Kanji Draw

upside down?

Kunitora

not Tora?

inscription

name guesses

Kabuki Thief

Kuniteru e Kunitora

Kuniteru

Signature mistery solved